See full script at: forerunner.com (Drawing or painting of Matthew 2:16 Massacre of the Innocents) In confronting the sin of abortion, we must keep our focus in spiritual perspective. The Bible tells us: “Our battle is not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in the heavenly places” (Ephesians 6:12). Our enemy in fighting abortion is not the abortionist, the courts, or those who are advocating for abortion rights. Our enemy is the one who was a murderer from the beginning – Satan and the spiritual forces under his command. (Shots of Supreme Court, pro-choice demonstrators) Throughout history, certain pagan cultures have sacrificed human infants to their deities as part of a complicated ritual in return for favors asked of them. While few of those involved in abortion today are consciously engaging in child sacrifice, that is precisely what abortion is the sacrifice of a human life for the convenience or needs of others. In that respect, it is no less barbaric than the human sacrifice practiced to ensure, for example, a successful harvest. But beyond this, there is a spiritual, satanically inspired dimension that gives frightening realism to abortion’s identification with literal child sacrifice. (Wiccan Initiation ritual with man kneeling before sword – WITCHCRAFT YESTERDAY AND TODAY 53:07) The Bible supports this idea as often we see a particular action viewed …
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These desperate concoctions of biblical justification are an abomination of human intellect. Have you no dignity?
Your willingness to believe in the existence of a supernatural influence on your destiny allows you to attempt to distill moral goodness from a fabricated, edited and censured collection of primitive texts written by ignorant men. It is truly shameful!
Abortion is certainly deeply undesirable. And equally undesirable is the self-centred justifying waffle of the religious faithful.
@EqualAndFree
Doesn’t God see the inner workings of our heart? What good would it do to conceal our true feelings from the Lord even when they are not squeaky clean emotions? The Bible is not free from the expression of anger, lust, depression and sorrow…it keeps it 100% real. If you read 1/3 of the psalms, you will notice a theme of cries for help against conflicting groups. These songs reveal anger even unto God. They sometimes, disclose a sense of abandonment from God. 100% honesty.
abortion is unholy we are all brought into this life the same way The bible says God is against child sacrafice and turned away from the Israelies when they were worshipping idols and sacraficing children…Jesus Christ our lord and savior was concieved the same way we are….
@EqualAndFree
Ask a local pastor or ministerto help you b/c either you don’t want an answer, which is most atheist (I don’t want to ever suggest that about you…*cought*), or I’m just being confusing or you just really are having a hard time understanding symbolism.
Why don’t you ever answer a simple question with a simple and relevant answer? Why, when I ask how the sacrificial death of Jesus helps us, do I get an “answer” with nothing but quotes about Adam & Eve. Then, when I ask about that, I get quotes from the Sermon on the Mount that are also nothing to do with child sacrifice. “Explaining” one verse by reference to another equally obscure and unrelated one doesn’t help. Just give a rational explanation in plain English without using any more verses.
@EqualAndFree
Its a poem of figurative language. Obviously verse 9 would not be a blessing but a curse. There are so many other verse in the Bible of actual worship of Moloch where the nota of worship is baby sacrifice. THis is not condoned by God. God doesn’t call for this type of behavior in worship of himself. These are rituals of worship to false idols in which God hates… “They worshiped idols, though the LORD had said, “You shall not do this.” 2 Kings 17:12
@EqualAndFree
part 3
God said blessed are the poor in spirit. God said blessed are they that mourn: for they shall be comforted. God said he would blessed the meek, those who hunger and thirst after righteousness, those who are merciful, pure in heart, and peacemakers. – Matthew 5.
I believe God has aborted babies also in his heart when he says blessed are ye, when men shall revile you, and persecute you, and shall say all manner of evil against you falsely, for my sake.
It’s a Psalm – a song to God. You don’t put things in Psalms that you’re ashamed of and think are against the will of God. Clearly they believed that this killing of infants by them accorded with the will of God. Can’t you see the problem.
@EqualAndFree
part 2
….O daughter of Babylon, who art to be destroyed;
happy shall he be, that rewaredth thee
as the has severed us.
Verse 9: Happy shall he be, that taketh and dasheth thy little ones against the stones.
Do you get it now? THis is an account of the anger of slaves against their cruel masters.
They were angery…thats life and its in the Bible. I’m so glade you know how what this verse means, now you can go and tell someone else.
You want to know what God blessed?
@EqualAndFree
part 1
THis is a misinterpretation of Psalm 137:9
To understand this verse you must look at the whole entire chapter…its a poem. If you take a line from a poem, it could mean a range of things. Context is your friend.
This chapter is about the the Israelites weeping b/c they are sorrowful about being held captive and being treated harshly by the Babylonians. They are not just sad about being captives but they are angry & in verse 8 it says…
cont….
This killing of babies is clearly not just an account of historical crimes. It is clearly written as if it was the will of God. Psalm 137:9 even says “Blessed shall he be who takes your little infants and dashes them against the rock!”. Blessed by whom? Surely this means blessed by God for doing as God wishes. Why did God wish to bless the killing of babies?
You say “Why? is it that people expect God to shield them and protect them when they keep running away from the armor of God?” – were even the unborn children running away?
Hosea 13:16 says “Samaria shall become desolate; for she hath rebelled against her God: they shall fall by the sword: their infants shall be dashed in pieces, and their women with child shall be ripped up”.
– It’s not just a historical account. God clearly wished unborn children to be killed for other peoples crimes.
If God wanted us to “recognize him” why would he deliberately make himself invisible (and not even leave a giant footprint or carve his name on the moon as a clue) then punish us for not believing he exists? Isn’t that an odd way to behave?
If he wanted to save Adam and Eve he could have sent them a message about how to behave. He didn’t. Jesus only came thousands of years later. A message from Jesus might be useful – but HOW could his sacrificial DEATH help us? That’s what you don’t explain.
You say that A&E were “built with the ability to love”. But logically they can’t have been because until they ate the fruit they didn’t know good from evil – so they could have neither loved nor hated. They would just have had the minds of babies with no moral understanding or meaningful emotions at all. It was eating the fruit that enabled them to know good from evil. Only then were they able to make moral choices. But by then it was too late and they were already doomed to be punished.
OK. Let’s assume this is symbolic and not literal.
What does it mean to say that Jesus or Abraham’s lamb was “symbolically” slain rather than really slain? Does that make more sense than it really happening?
Or do you mean that as a result we are “symbolically” saved rather than really saved? Does that help it to make more sense?
How does “thinking symbolically” help to make sense of the sentence?
But let’s ignore all those logical problems. If Adam and Eve did something wrong then logically they should have been asked to undo the damage or apologize or accept a punishment. How could the death of an innocent lamb or the death of Jesus solve Adam and Eve’s problem? It’s not logical.
And what has the action of Adam and Eve got to do with me? Guilt and blame don’t get passed on to children. I’m guilty of things I do wrong. I’m not guilty or to blame for what my parents or grandparents did.
Who told the truth about the Tree?
God said “But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for on the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die”. – But they didn’t die that day or even that year. Apparently Adam lived until he was 930 years old.
The serpent said “Ye shall not surely die: For God doth know that in the day ye eat thereof, then your eyes shall be opened, and ye shall be as gods, knowing good and evil” -Apparently that’s just what happened.
1. Before A&E ate the fruit they didn’t know what was good or what was evil.
2. You can’t be guilty of doing something wrong unless you know it’s wrong.
3. How could they know it was wrong to eat the fruit BEFORE they had that knowledge?
4. What is wrong anyway in knowledge of good and evil? Jesus and Moses taught good and evil. Was that a sinful thing to do?
5. Even though eating it was an innocent error God punishes not just them but all their unborn descendants. Where’s the justice in that?
@EqualAndFree
What is your question?
You may not agree with my answer but none-the less it is an answer.
@EqualAndFree
God doesn’t want to be separated from us. God could have said eh, lets just talk this over some apples & Fuhgeddabouddit, however the rules and order of life apply to everything. Ppl make the decision every day to not even recognize him. God wanted us to follow him in this life and join him after this life. He could have just let us die and their would be no salvation but God wanted to send his son for salvation for us.<------what can I do to help you understand this part?
@EqualAndFree
You must be able to think deep & apply logic. If you can tell me why come God didn’t just let Adam and Eve live for ever and ever after they sinned then you would have your answer…
God has to follow the order of things according to the way Adam and EVe responded to their choice to commit sin. God does this not b/c he doesn’t have power…but b/c he loved Adam and Eve and if God were to over ride it all…that would be saying that God is a liar. THink deeper.
@EqualAndFree
God doesn’t want to be separated from us. God could have said eh, lets just talk this over some apples & Fuhgeddabouddit, however the rules and order of life apply to everything. Ppl make the decision every day to not even recognize him. God wanted us to follow him in this life and join him after this life. He could have just let us die and their would be no salvation but God wanted to send his son for salvation for us.<------what can I do to help you understand this part?
@EqualAndFree
Baby steps…
When God created Adam (A) and Eve (E), his intent was that they live forever and that the good of his hands would never cease or end in death. However A & E were built with the ability to love. A person can not love if they are not given choice to love. They both decided to sin and as a result God had to banish them from heave b/c their sin separated them from God. <------ What can I do to help you understand this part? cont.
@EqualAndFree
“Jesus is the Lamb who was slain to save us” is an utterly and totally meaningless sentence.”
Dear…This is the key. If you are not able to think symbolically then you are trouble when trying to understand it all.
@EqualAndFree
You must be able to think deep & apply logic. If you can tell me why come God didn’t just let Adam and Eve live for ever and ever after they sinned then you would have your answer…
God has to follow the order of things according to the way Adam and EVe responded to their choice to commit sin. God does this not b/c he doesn’t have power…but b/c he loved Adam and Eve and if God were to over ride it all…that would be saying that God is a liar. THink deeper.