Question by wiccanhpp: Pagans: Are there any Shamans, Witches, Ceremonial Magicians, etc who…?
…have used legal herbs in a ritual or to induce sacred meditations? I have an interesting book on Native American Shamans and their experiences, but I’d like to hear of your experiences with legal herbs. (henbane, datura, morning glory, etc.) ONLY 18 OR OVER SHOULD ANSWER, PLEASE.
Greg, cutsie answer, but you’re sooooo wrong 😉
Again, over 18 and serious answers only.
Don’t bother with the “looking for an excuse to get high” BS, because you’re obviously clueless to what I am speaking of. Don’t go away mad, just go away. Next…
Hm…I wonder what would make people think that ONLY Native Americans can pick and use a peyote button?? It’s certainly not true…
Philly D, thanks and I agree. Frau, the herbs I am speaking of are all legal, although soome (ESPECIALLY Datura strains and Salvia Divinorum) should be used wisely. You need to know exactly how much to take because these are especially potent. I have studied herbology extensively (also alchemy and ethnobotany) and it takes a bit of know-how to use these drugs safely and also not to abuse them by utilizing them again too soon. I just wondered if anyone had any experiences to share.
That’s interesting stuff, Philly…I had read that that particualar strain could last up to 36 hours!
Intersting, stuff, Philly! I knew that Salvia Divinorum can have immediate effects (depending upon how you extract the active substance) but there have been instances where it lasted up to 36 hours! I’m happy he had a good experience with it; some do not favor its effects at all. Thanks for answering!
I got several good answers here…thanks for sharing. As I mentioned, I have studied this extensively (those who said that you can harm yourself if you don’t know what you’re doing are *correct*…you can indeed overdose on certain strains of passiflora — passion flower– datura, belladonna and many others. The government is really crazy about making something as superficial as pot illegal, yet others remain growing in the wild you can find seeds in your local Home Depot! also, many Witches probably have certain herbs in their magickal cabinet: mugwort, wormwood, even catnip that can have euphoric or hallucinatory capabilities, even though we may only use them for magickal purposes and never ingest them.) It’s tough to pick only one answer, but here goes…Thanks to all who shared intelligent thought. BB
Best answer:
Answer by greg x
smoke some pot and youll have the same results.
Know better? Leave your own answer in the comments!
You’re just looking for an excuse to get high.
You can reach a state of trance through drumming. The drugs only help the process along, but you can reach it without using them.
I think I read somewhere that only a full blood native american can use peyote.
I also read toad licking can get you into a strange frame of mind, but never did drugs to reach a trance.
Many cultures have used mind altering substances with the intent of reaching a higher consciousness.
And don’t we still do that? Even “ordinary” people?
Feeling sluggish and sleepy in the morning? Are you grabbing for a cup of coffee or an energy beverage?
Feeling shy or nervous at a party, or feeling wound up at the end of the day? Are you pouring yourself a glass of wine or having a cocktail?
Does anyone here use tobacco?
There is a definite difference between drug use, and drug abuse. Using a substance just to get messed up is never to be encouraged. Using a substance responsibly for an intended spiritual connection or inward journey is another story.
I personally can reach a state I’d like to be in through meditation, trance work, ecstatic dance, drumming, repeating a mantra, etc.. I don’t feel a need to experiment with any substances. But I will not scold anyone else who chooses to do so.
One of my friends has used Salvia Divinorum. He is a Buddhist. He was even featured on the local news here in Philly once. His face was all blurred out and his voice was altered, of course, to protect his privacy.
He invited me to witness one occassion where he used it. It was pretty interesting. The effects were immediate, and then wore off within ten minutes. He claims that it takes you into an instant sense of being connected to the Universe.
I have tranced out during drumming. About the only way I could meditate (I am so Type A). Drumming is a safe and legal way to reach altered states. I never knew which herbs might interact with my meds and I was beyond straightedge when I was Wiccan.
Hope that helps
Way before I became Wiccan I tried Pot and didn’t like how it made me feel.
Now that I am Wiccan I prefer to meditate with drums, candles, and music.
Each person is responsible for their own lives but please keep in mind that just because it is legal does not mean that it wont cause harm to you.
Blessings
I do not do any drugs who are illegal, and manage to reach, through much difficulty, similar states of consciousness through ritual, meditation, drumming, etc.
However, I don’t believe the government should make illegal herbs which are SACRAMENT to so many religions, including most traditional native religions here long before the governments appeared! This is a serious seperation of church and state issue, and anti-American. If your religious sacrament is Marijuana, or if it’s a mushroom containing Psilocibin, it’s not the place of government to hinder a religion’s sacramental choices.
I believe there are some herbs, which are far more dangerous (because the dosages are harder to get right) but are legal to take and can induce these sacred states….. Wyrmwood, Belladonna are two I can think of right off the top of my head.
http://www.herbs.com/Web_store/web_store.cgi?page=SubIndexPages/Wormwood.html&cart_id=8214096.15366
http://www.botanical.com/botanical/mgmh/n/nighde05.html
To my knowledge, both of these are deadly if taken too much of! But neither are illegal… You’ve got to ask yourself if the governmental regulations stop the safest religious drugs from legallity, but leave ones that very well could kill you, what is the true reason behind such absurd laws?
I have tried nutmeg (the spice) a couple of times. It’s perfectly legal and you get it in every kitchen.
The dosage is about 1 gram per 5 – 10 killos of body weight. Be careful, though, it takes a VERY long time before it starts working, even as much as 6-8 hours. You peak after about 8-12 hours. DO NOT take another dose after a couple of hours, it will not bring on the experience on any quicker, but you’re in danger of overdosing.
There’s another drawback, which is it tastes HORRIBLE.
About the high: it starts very very slowly and gradually, at first you just experience slightly heightened senses (especially sense of touch). Then after a while, you start experiencing synesthesia (merging of senses). It was really cool for me the first time, I was lying in a dark room, meditating a bit, and I had some low atmospheric music on. After a while, the music took a tangible form and it was all around me, I could actually feel the tones on my skin. It was wonderful.
The third trip wasn’t so good, though, I was just hyper-sensitive to everything to the point where it annoyed me. So it really depends if you have a good or a bad trip.
Just DO NOT overdose, because it takes an equally long time (6 hours) after the peak for the effects to go away completely. Make sure you have a FULL day of time, with nothing to do, because you will feel slightly weird for hours after the experience and you can’t really do aynthing when you’re in the state like that.
I agree with Tahuti. I think the Government, if you can legitimately prove you belong to a religion that has such a sacrament, they should legalize it for you and any other religions that wish to use that drug for their sacrament.
I’ve heard Peyote is a cool drug to do for spiritual reasons.
Marijuana is also a good one.
Otherwise, I wouldn’t touch anything else I don’t think. Both of those drugs have little or no side-effects (except getting high!)
Salvia divorum works for me but only in 5 or 10x strength. Stay away from some of the stuff you mentioned. you must be getting involved with some Castenada stuff.